Major Plot Holes in Great Stories

[Reaver]

OK- I'm sure thisi may have been brought up in the past, but I'm new here and I gotta get this off my chest. I've recently re-read LOTR and I've hit upon a HUGE plot hole that never bugged me when I was younger, but as grow older and more cynical, it's REALLY bugging me. Here goes--Frodo and Sam go through hell for all of the first two books and 90 percent of the last...and then just as Mount Doom is falling down on top of them, the giant eagles swoop in and carry them to safety and respite in Rivendell. My problem is this, why didn't they just take the damn eagles to Mount Doom in the first place? Why go through all that trouble? My only answer is that Gandalf is a sadistic bastard who could've arranged the whole thing for them, but didn't. Am I alone in this opinion? Any comments/opinions are greatly appreciated.

 

[Steerpike]

Seems to me one big reason for the success against the strength of Sauron was that he didn't know exactly where the ring was or what the good guys were doing with it, so he was left spreading his power and forces pretty thin. If they'd been coming by air, I suspect Sauron would have seen them coming hundreds of miles away and devoted all of his resources to getting at them, in which case he might very well have been successful. Would the good guys have been willing to take that risk to put the ring in his hands? Would the eagles agree to it, being the ones to bear the brunt of Sauron's attention on the way in?

Some possible answers I suppose.

 

[myrddin173]

The more I think about it the less I think it is not a plot hole. The Eagles only go in, after the Nazgul are dead and their creepy mounts are out of comission. Also the Eagles did not carry them to Rivendell, they carried them to Ithilein which is between the Anduin and the western mountains of Mordor. (The Mountains of Shadow I think)

 

[Devor]

Flying creatures are pretty easy to spot, follow, and shoot down. They would not have made it to the mountain and would have brought Sauron's attention directly to their location. So they come in after the baddies are already broken.

 

[Ravana]

In addition to the above—though of somewhat less importance than how glaringly obvious approaching giant eagles would have been—there's also the question of how to contact the eagles in the first place. The one that rescues Gandalf from Isengard mentions he'd been sent to look for him by Radagast… who appears to spend a lot of time talking to birds. The Fellowship certainly isn't about to wait in Rivendell until someone can track down Radagast so that he can make the call.… The second time, it's Galadriel who sends the eagle; it isn't mentioned how she contacts it… but she's Galadriel. As for the two battles, the eagles just… well, "appear out of the blue," as it were. Which is the part about the eagles that bugged me.

We also don't know what the eagles' ability to carry burdens over distance are: apparently, humans (at least) push their limits somewhat, given the relatively short distance Gandalf gets conveyed—from Isengard to Edoras. (The same eagle later mentions how much easier he is to carry following his resurrection… even suggests dropping him to see if he'd float like a feather.) The hobbits, of course, weigh somewhat less. It might be reasonable to ask why they didn't carry the hobbits from Rivendell at least as far as Gondor (communications details aside), but I suspect the answer would have been much the same as with taking them to Mordor: too visible, especially as they'd have to pass reasonably close to Isengard in the process, and if weight were a concern, they'd be deprived of any escort into the bargain—which I doubt even Gandalf, with all his confidence in hobbits, would have thought especially wise.

 

[Reaver]

Thanks to everyone who replied to this. All of you have made excellent points and just to be clear...I love LOTR. Tolkien is a master storyteller and he created a mythology for a country that had theirs stolen from them. I just had to get that off of my chest.

 

[Devor]

. . . and he created a mythology for a country that had theirs stolen from them.

I'm a little confused, can I ask what you mean by that?

 

[myrddin173]

I'm a little confused, can I ask what you mean by that?

What I think he means is that when Rome invaded Britain the preexisting British mythology was smothered out of existence by the Roman overlords. Tolkien created a mythos for the British to replace the one that existed in pre-Roman times.

 

[Reaver]

Thanks myrddin173--that's exactly what I meant. Many people associate King Arthur and the Knights of the Round Table with being British mythology (or at least legend) (chiefly their quest for The Holy Grail) but although most experts disagree about the finer points of history...Arthur and company were most likely Roman overlords.

 

[Devor]

What I think he means is that when Rome invaded Britain the preexisting British mythology was smothered out of existence by the Roman overlords. Tolkien created a mythos for the British to replace the one that existed in pre-Roman times.

Thanks. I've never heard that take on Tolkein before, and I really appreciate the answer.