A thread I made on Reddit regarding stock (overaggressive) "strong" female characters

[FifthView]

While it's true that some people cower, some people fight but are ineffective, and some people fight back effectively, there seems to be no logic in any of those traits belonging to a specific group. Developing characters better would eliminate this as a negative trope and probably eliminate it from movies almost entirely.

The problem seems to arise naturally when dealing with characters who are significantly more powerful than other characters and involves how we communicate the power differential. Interestingly, this issue plays into the concept of "chosen ones" also, judging by the nearby thread on that topic. Weakness and strength may be real issues, the relative disparity may be an important element in the story, but either weakness or strength and the disparity can be drawn in a ridiculous way.

Sometimes, maybe, the power difference is truly ridiculous. Any normal person in an action-filled scene with Superman is simply going to pale in comparison. Unless of course the director throws a block of Kryptonite into the scene, allowing the woman/man an opportunity to save him.

There are some good examples however.

I think that Merry and Pippin in the first LOTR movie, cornered along with the much stronger Boromir, were handled well. Their rock-throwing had some effect, the situation was impossible not only for them but also Boromir, and picking up swords at the end to charge the Uruk-hai may have been ineffectual, but they were limited on options and had a very effective emotional reaction to Boromir's death. (Effective for the viewer, heh.)

The end of Stranger Things worked also, for at least two identical reasons. The monster was already shown to be quite powerful, and the situation was impossible already.

Spoiler: Relevant but spoilery conclusion to thought

Fortunately, their weak slingshot defense had a more powerful, erm, backup. (Rerverse situation: weakling boys being saved by a strong female character.)

At those moments, I felt dread for the two sets of characters, particular at that moment in Stranger Things. The power differential was absurd, and this made it frightening.

I do think one problem with some other scenarios might be the fact that whoever is the weaker character might just happen to fall into a particular religious or ethnic class, or might be one sex or sexual orientation, or whatever. This could trigger some readers/viewers, and not without cause if the general setup and writing is bad. So being more creative in setting up the characters and situations, while being conscientious, can only be a good thing, I think.

 

[Trick]

The problem seems to arise naturally when dealing with characters who are significantly more powerful than other characters and involves how we communicate the power differential. Interestingly, this issue plays into the concept of "chosen ones" also ... I do think one problem with some other scenarios might be the fact that whoever is the weaker character might just happen to fall into a particular religious or ethnic class, or might be one sex or sexual orientation, or whatever. This could trigger some readers/viewers, and not without cause if the general setup and writing is bad. So being more creative in setting up the characters and situations, while being conscientious, can only be a good thing, I think.

Couldn't agree more. I think Batman stands out because he is merely human, though highly skilled. Iron Fist also; yes, he has a fist that punches through walls blah blah, but he's basically just a master martial artist. Batman has devices that could do what his fist does so... they're pretty similar.

Perhaps the power differential isn't great enough in those situations and so the Slap the Joker moments seem patronizing and belittling instead of being demonstrative of the futility of fighting supers when you're not a super.

 

[pmmg]

Just want to go on record and say, I did not really find Rachel Dawes slapping of the joker to be patronizing. Though, in the movie I think she actually punches him, and he seems affected by it. The part that bothered me is Christian Bale's gruff voice trying cutting in. In activity prior, she actually seems quite frightened of the joker. Anyway...

I guess I would ask, how many of you approach your characters with thoughts like "Uh, if I don't change this scene the women readers will think I write weak female characters?" Just write them as they are. Some are weak. No need to apologize.

 

[RedAngel]

I think that especially since Rachel finds out that Batman is Bruce in Batman Begins. She had to of known that He would be there at the party when the Joker arrived. And rather than letting the old man get his throat slit she bought bruce some time by speaking up. She does get more fearful as the scene goes on. But I think that as the tension grows that is the last thing she can do to distance herself from the Joker until Batman finally arrives.

It did not bother me the first time I saw the scene. But after rewatching it I still did not mind her outburst as the plasuability of her and the actions she takes does make some sense as it seems out of character for her.

 

[Annoyingkid]

I don't like the idea if romance or sex makes her no longer act aggressive. Makes it seem like she was just sexually frustrated this whole time. If she develops out of that aggression, it has to be carefully and slowly done I think. I would not want to see her go from one of the few willing to call out the MC's flaws, to someone vacuous and just there to be lovey dovey with the MC. And how come she-elves can't seem to find dudes their own damn species? Maybe that's why so many interpretations of elves are fading? The females seem to go after humans, dwarves (Tauriel WHY) and everything in between before those poor elf males!

 

[RedAngel]

Lol you bring up a good point about the Elves. Maybe the men started that trend and the women don't want to keep the species going and have a fancy for mortals? You never hear about the male elvish conquests on other races. funny.

 

[Brian Scott Allen]

dwarves (Tauriel WHY)

 

[TheCrystallineEntity]

^That made me laugh.

 

[TheCrystallineEntity]

Speaking of elves, The Tale of Beren and Luthien is one of my favourite stories, especially since Luthien basically saves Beren all by herself, and does most of the work on the Silmaril quest.